Indians managed to retain a broadly sympathetic sentiment in the UK until very recently, with Dvija Hindu doctors and rustic Punjabi factory workers being seen as basically law-abiding, industrious and willing to integrate, if liable to overly aromatic cooking.
The recent proliferation of Boriswave Deliveroo Shudras in the UK has tarnished all our names. That, and the crimes of our increasingly restive Pakistani Muslim cousins whom the average White Brit struggles to conceptually distinguish us from.
So you imported your petty caste divisions? I did business in India for a decade. So your telling me you imported all that petty shit where each caste LARP who is more white?
I sold white skin cream btw. Marketed as a value added good from Switzerland. We had a dutch teenage blue eyed girl on the label. Maybe you have seen it.
We're on the border with Pakistan and cluster with Afghanistan more than mainland India. Are you going to tell the North East who look like Chinks the same thing?
Caste is wrong simply because it lets niggers live.
There is plenty of space in that era. I did business in India for a decade. I am aware of the nuance.
I can appreciate it to
There is tons of space in central asia. Beautiful new city states could be birthed. A network state of your peoples capital. You offshore Yuan capital flight. The Swiss of central asia. What ever it takes
You guys don’t get it. Everyone is just making a claim on your space. The entire “vitality” movement is a limited hangout. There is no vitality without space. Without adequate space you are just a sickly organism. Lebensraum.Corn spaced too close? Cabbage? Up to 10× less yield. Animals in close cages? 10× chance of disease.Making concessions to any round of immigrants so they can have your space? Lol.Pause for a moment you retards. Especially BAP. He is 45 and his hobby is fucking mulatto gay for pay in a favela. He is not a tiger who needs space. He is a by-product of high entropy environments that lack space. Migrants with poor dads in a striver suburb.Mao? Stalin? They provided new space for a new generation.Why is it anyone’s job to give concessions to Indians. New or old. If they want more space. They can do the dirty, and elect a lizard to devour the population.But they are a cucked pacifist Hindu society where eating meat is seen as an eternal sin.So for their cuckery you must give concessions??
No, as someone living in England and privy to private discussions among native Whites, they never viewed having Indians as desirable. Southall & Wembley & Leicester have always been regarded with derision.
It’s not a hard problem, it is just a matter of will, unlike say deporting 10 million illegals which seems like fantasy to me. I say this as someone very familiar with the tech industry (have worked years in so called Big Tech) and the Indian situation. Most Indians, especially the competent tech workers that are on H1b getting 200k+ salaries are on an H1b that gets renewed every year while they’re waiting for their green cards (which has a multiple decades long wait line). Just don’t renew their H1bs and they’ll leave, they’re not going to become illegal fast food workers just to stay in US, they have a reasonably pleasant life waiting for them back in India (sucks if they’re a fan of skiing though).
But there’s also a large number of illegal Indians in US now, and a lot of supposedly legal Indians who are just gaming the system through consultancies and other scams. The 100k requirement for every H1b application (even one time is fine) would kill most of this. Honestly I think 100k per year that we thought Trump was implementing was ideal, it would kill most early career immigration and keep the good folks that I don’t have a problem with. On that note, even the O1 has got to go, a highly paid H1b is far better technically than the average O1, there are all sorts of scams going on in the O1 system with buying conference papers, reference letters, judging worthless competitions etc etc.
In the end, this is a question of will, there are very simple solutions, we don’t even need an operation wetback 2.0, a few simple rules and we can get rid of 90% of such immigration.
Yes BAP great article. Most 2nd gen indians will completely agree with you, even liberal ones, especially ones in UK and Canada. Besides just feelings of embarrassment toward our unassimilated co-ethnics, we are also more acutely aware of the deeper consequences of mass immigration, many of which you have accurately surfaced in this article. Wat can be done, this poses civilizational
I'm sorry, but there is absolutely no way that "most" 2nd generation Indians would agree that the current state of Indian immigration is problematic. That is total fantasy.
Many do I've spoken with several. Parents put them into the full Canadian experience, played hockey as a kid, went to university, doing corporate jobs, some medicine. They agree. One upset because their parents are being treated differently now.
I genuinely don’t think takes of this nature matter, and they are generally couched in lame attempts to deride and shame. No. We want nations, not pretend playthings for faggot merchants.
I don't really see democracy as being viable in the yookay. Whatever happens there will be at the sole discretion of the first guy to prevent the government from stopping him from solving the migrant problem however he prefers to do so.
I find myself wishing I were more sympathetic. Like you and your examples, I harbored some admiration for elements of Indian culture. Especially its history of religion, as I would discuss regularly with a Hindu (a convert, but very theologically minded) friend of mine. Surely there must be something that fascinated the world in general, and the minds of Anglo luminaries in particular, about a land they tried so long and so desperately to have as their own.
And yet I find myself now simply out of patience. Whatever the wonders of the Subcontinent, its history, culture, religion, etc., the constant, day in and day out, actions and behaviors of its people are so far removed from those formidable heights it seems the only rational conclusion is that there's simply no connection between the achievements of the past and the people today. Even as Indians themselves thump their chests over it, it all comes off a bit like Boomer conservative reference for the Founders or Constitution: endlessly counting one's (alleged) ancestors more dearly than one's sons.
You make a heartful appeal to those genuinely capable, talented Indians. Those that must surely have endured much to escape what are genuinely among the most wretched conditions still on Earth. And yet, over and over, we're subject to these "elite" emigres siding time and against with the very worst aspects of their society. Dinesh D'souza, someone who's been in the US for forty years and has probably few familial ties to his country of origin, recently boasting that the future belongs to poo-throwers, comes to mind. Like he's gleeful even now to hurl people he himself would have nothing to do with as missiles at non-Indians. To harbor such gloating resentment for so long would almost be impressive in its determination, if it weren't so tirelessly predictable.
I suppose in the end, it just feels like it's all been one massive fraud. A Potemkin culture propped up by 19th century Anglo fascination in the other that has long since faded to reality. One that was evident as early as the ballads of Kipling (himself quite enamored with India and having lived there nearly all his life) making sharp critiques of the locals' shameless striver mentality. Even though I agree much of the critique has lost substance and devolved into zero-effort copycat posting for clout, the fatigue is real, and I suspect we're all going to be waiting a long time before their "highly skilled, elite human capital," develops any qualms over their frankly cartoonish cruelty.
BAP addressed this in the article, if you saw. He said it’s a classical/antique “flavor” of the highest heights existing alongside the lowest lows (in human quality terms).
From my personal experience, knowing Indians/other desis from across the gamut of castes and regions, I think he’s definitely right. I’ve known (desi) artists & musicians, electrical engineers, inventors, all of whom were genuinely good (and I say that as a highly disagreeable heritage American who is not so easily impressed), and I’ve known convenience store owners and Mirpuri (yes we have them too) criminal retards that made me wonder why exactly I pay taxes if this is what the government does to my city.
The salient point now is that the numbers are unassimilable, irreconcilable, even if we were *trying* to assimilate them (which as BAP points out we don’t). But that fact doesn’t remove the obvious reality that many subcons of genuine quality are here, and there is much to like about India and (good) Indians, while still acknowledging that we shouldn’t let any more move here, should probably deport most of those already here, and should certainly disenfranchise that whole population in terms of political and judicial power.
You people don't help your case when you use words like “frankly cartoonish cruelty" and “harbor such gloating resentment for so long", especially if you're an anglo. What do you think was a reasonable middle ground after the anglos having leeched off everything they could from India. I won't say “45 trillion" but the anglos did come to India only to extract wealth and that was their whole incentive for two centuries. They left the country poorer than subsaharan Africa and now you're mad that the descendants of those people have enough agency to thrive in your home at your expense, in the least violent way possible?
The fatigue you have is real and if I was in your shoes I'd think so too but the white fatigue is much older and more intolerable at this point with the most vocal complaints about tech workers being replaced coming from people whose entire lives revolve around America's God, politics. Most Indians don't come to America with an idea of exacting revenge but simply because there's better opportunities, but the discourse has demonized Indians to the point that this framework is how the ruling cabinet now operates with. Don't be surprised when the other side recognizes it and acts accordingly.
Every civilization has its ups and downs and the conquerors don't just get to walk away and not integrate with the conquered. Ask the Romans who enslaved the Greeks if it worked out for them, when their slaves were far wiser and more productive than the masters they were forced to serve.
"Most Indians don't come to America with an idea of exacting revenge but simply because there's better opportunities, but the discourse has demonized Indians to the point that this framework is how the ruling cabinet now operates with."
What do you think was the genesis of this demonization? Where did it spring from? What is the motivation?
Simple ethnic resentment won't do it for you? 20th century was unprecedented in human history so a bunch of problems were offset by it. Now, opportunities are drying up and more people are competing for a shrinking pool of opportunities. They see immigrants come in and succeed which is worse than importing an underclass from central america, per the modal citizen thing BAP talked about.
Nothing about Indians' low trust behavior? Building 100 foot statues on deities on the landscape? Voting against the interests of heritage Americans 80% of time?
In fact, no. Whites have the same seething ethno narcissism they project onto others. Do you vote for Indian interests? Why should anyone vote against their interests? Say more Indian Americans has voted for Trump and historically voted Republican, would whites stop resenting them for being browns and succeeding in America? They're a small enough population that it wouldn't have prevented Obama or similar, and any Indian Americans who voted for Trump still log onto twitter and see frothing resentment even for benign things like posting photos of their festivals. Why would any rational man vote for that?
What are you even arguing about with 100 foot statues? Did the state subsidize them with your tax dollars?
No, I don't vote for Indian interests. I vote for American interests. Nation first.
Having been in America for 40+ years and found success, I know for a fact that whites have never resented me for success. They appreciated Indian (and immigrant) success. The recent backlash against Indians is very new (last 5 years) and is based on a few things:
1) The overwhelming amount of influx of Indians over the last decade. Entire departments of corporations being fired and turned over to low wage commodity white collar labor H1-Bs under the false pretense of "we couldn't find any American to fill these roles."
2) Low trust behaviors--cutting in line, trying to negotiate set prices, reneging handshake deals, etc. About ten years ago, I noticed that contractors in my city (mostly Mexican) refused to work with Indians for these reasons.
3) Woke views and doing the bidding of the woke industrial complex against the interests of heritage Americans with some very public figures at the forefront-- Vijaya Gadde, Parag Agarwal, Sundar Pichai, Pramila Jayapal, Saira Rao, etc.
"They resent us because we are outcompeting them." Indentured servitude is not outcompeting. It's making yourself a temporary slave.
The idea that Indians are now outcompeting is laughable. You don't outcompete if your message is...
"Dear American corporation--
I'll work for longer hours and fewer dollars than the American and I won't even have a choice to leave or I'll have to go back to India."
...you are not outcompeting. You are selling your labor for less.
Outcompeting would entail charging more for your labor as you would be more valuable than the next guy.
What I see in your post is insecurity (very common among Indians) mollifying itself as "we're finally winning and the whites are jealous." You're not winning. You're prostituting yourself at low prices on behalf of billionaires who are happy to throw their fellow Americans into the river for higher profits.
I'm arguing about 100 foot statues because that behavior is a violation of American cultural norms. It doesn't help your cause.
Your worldview is fundamentally incompatible with American civilization. You should move to a country that is more in line with your worldview.
As one of these Indians in America (though came much much earlier than the recent surge) who loves America and American culture (at least the culture that existed in the 80s and 90s but unfortunately does not today), I largely agree with the article with some small counters below. First some comments towards Indians if you're reading this:
1) Indians need to recognize they are cheap labor. Yes, that's right, you are cheap labor. In the current surge, you are white collar Mexicans. Your immigration surge has been sold to the public as "skilled labor" but make no mistake, you are cheap commodity labor being used to replace white Americans who cost more to employ than you.
Why would whites do this? Just as there are Hindus in India that work against the thriving of Hinduism in India and want nothing more than the destruction of Hindu civilization, there are whites in America who want nothing more than to see whites suffer.
2) You did not invent Silicon Valley. American innovation existed long before there was a single Indian in America and would continue if every single Indian was deported.
3) You know how Muslims will block the road and start praying in groups? You know the motivation there: it's a flex and a dare: "What are you going to do about it?" A softer version of that is building giant statues of Hindu deities on the American landscape that can be seen by the public from afar. There are no giant statues of Jesus or Mary on the landscape nor even giant crosses. Be polite toward the host culture and stop that shit right now.
4) Have some appreciation for why America "works" and India doesn't. America will stop working if too many Indians come all at once.
5) Stop blaming Americans for historic British actions. America was also part of the colonial project. They fought (and defeated) in war the British.
6) Why come to America if you're only going to congregate among other Indians? Do you just want India with better infrastructure?
7) Just because Indians came to America in the past does not mean that every Indian has a right to come to America forever. There's a time and place for immigration and these circumstances change over time. America is currently heading toward a huge slowdown, and perhaps even a complete stop in immigration.
Notes to BAP and Indian skeptics:
1) While I appreciate the ideas of the Vedas, there's a slightly different aspect by which I appreciate Hinduism: that of divinity in all things, whether nature, the self, the Universe, or other people. We offer prayers to the Sun upon rising, revere the nature around us, hold sacred the cow which feeds us and our children, bless the food which nourishes us before each meal by first offering to the gods, revere the knowledge which enlightens us (never to touch a book with our feet), bow down before our parents that raise us, and try to become one with the Universe which created us. There's divinity in all things to greater or lesser degrees. These ideas are better distilled in the Upanishads which I think you've praised before.
(To others, you might only know about Hinduism through monkey gods and elephant gods, but Hinduism is a rich philosophical tradition whose essential idea--"dharma"--is basically way to seek ways to build civilization.)
2) I think your characterization of Patels and of other Indians' views of Patels is off. Patels are a hard working, simple living, fairly uncorrupt (IMO) group. In America they are much more likely to vote conservative, and Gujarat is the most pro Hindu state in India, least tolerant of Islamic shenanigans, and the most highly developed as well. They are traditionally NOT a mercantile caste, but rather a farmer or "kulak" status. Most Indians respect Gujaratis. See these threads on Quora (a great place to mine for sentiment about all things India).
IMO, the sentiment among Indians toward Gujaratis is similar to what Americans think of Mormons, or did so about 10-20 years ago.
Note that most of the elite Indian-Americans who work against Americans (Vijaya Gadde, Sundar Pichai, Saira Rao, the Silicon Valley elite, etc) are not Patels or Gujaratis. The typical South Indian elite tech worker in San Francisco is much more likely to look down upon everyday Americans, embrace wokism, and vote Democrat.
3) I appreciate your views of what India would be like without Hinduism. IMO, it would turn into Pakistan or Afghanistan. Not a mode for thriving. India can only thrive with Hinduism, which is why it's risen to prominence under the first Hindu-first leader in the better part of a thousand years (Modi).
4) Also appreciate your thoughts on what Europe and America might be like under a polytheistic order. While in my lifetime, Christianity falling has resulted in a worsening of the culture, and I wish Christianity would make a comeback as a bulwark against wokism, the European people have thrived before under polytheism (Greek history and most of Roman history) and might thrive again.
What you say is largely true, but there are a lot of gentile white males in the Northeast, along the West Coast, in academia, media, marketing, and board rooms who absolutely hate white America.
See the Nick Land tweet. “Never get so racist that you forget white leftists are the worst people in existence”. Obviously there exist white (male) leftists—unless you think all European males in the US were pathetically conquered by women and jews, somehow? FDR and LBJ and their many supporters I suppose being women, or jewish?
Every old white man at the no kings protest being jewish too, in your imagination? Every MSNBC-watching zombie retard, too?
To be honest, I think the fact that the sheer degree of diplomatic language in this post is necessary will make it insufficient. Any people with the capacity for self-awareness would have been convinced by the self-evident truth that they are making peoples that could conquer them with a thousand riflemen hate them with all of their hearts. Being allowed to behave the way that they have been behaving has pushed their already very limited capacity for introspection past the event horizon.
I don't think there's any diplomatic resolution, here. It ends when a vengeful tide of White male 20-somethings seizes power, cuts off the remittances, and sends the ones who didn't lash out on social media back to India unharmed, sans their belongings. Trying to negotiate something neater is like trying to convince Ben Shapiro not to dig himself any deeper, and Benji's got 30 IQ points on this lot.
What happened to the Italians with the RICO act will come down on Indians in America as well, though probably much more subdued because they’re more spread out across the country, as opposed to one region like the Italians
I'm skeptical of the comparison. Italians did not go out of their way to make the people around them miserable, and were ultimately capable of success and assimilation on a level playing field. You could neatly amputate organized crime from their social structure and still be left with something meaningful after it was gone.
The current wave of Indian migrants was brought in solely to make life worse for the native population. They don't have the option of happily assimilating into America, they are backed solely by a ruling class that wants obedient intermediaries, and their options after that ruling class falls are nonexistent.
No, the options they have after the ruling class fails are violence, which is what you people are edging towards. It would be very funny if WW3 happened because white zoomers had black tier ethnonarcissim and blamed the world for their failures. What's happening now is what happens every time two civilizations clash and one comes out on top: the conquered people won't just sit down for centuries and not try to extract wealth the same way the conquerors did. You people are quick to point out that companies don't hire you because hiring Indians is good for them in the short term at the expense of long term quality, but don't have the foresight to see the anglos of the last 3 centuries in the same light. They left the world's richest nation poorer than subsaharan Africa for their short term gains and you think their descendants would've just taken that face down and not even try their hand in the new world? Who asked England to find colonialism as the easiest way to prosperity?
Your problem is that you're ethnonarcissists and comparatively unagentic to boot. Everything needs to be someone else's fault that you're not winning. If someone who didn't even grow up with your language is succeeding in your home more than you, maybe someday have some humility to think how much of it is your fault than to just see them as malicious actors.
The most insulting thing to me in all this discourse isn't the brimestone tier name calling and insulting our gods, because that's just low IQ seething, but the way many anons on twitter gloat about colonialism while being offensively stupidly blindsided about the repercussions of it. You're living them, and you could've never escaped them in any alternate timeline. I mean it with no malice to you.
> you think their descendants would've just taken that face down
You paint yourselves as righteous rebels wanting revenge. I'm not going to humor that self-important schlock. You came here on a leash, you know full well who let you in, and you serve them even more slavishly than you served the British. Ask the British how they treat useful tools. The Brits at least had IQs of 100 and decent hygiene - Israelis can tolerate a day with a Brit, but they feel the same disgust at an Indian as everyone else on the planet.
You want a historical metaphor? You are ZOG's Tutsis, if the Hutus stood nine inches taller, if the Hutus had twenty more IQ points on average, and if the Tutsis had the arrogance to spend every moment as privileged intermediaries making the Hutus hate them more.
The more I see people like you resent someone just looking for better opportunities and taking them the more I realize you people really would prefer an all out war. It's so tiresome talking to whites, always yapping about IQ and the noise comes from terminally politically active people who wouldn't get a job at Google if the hiring policy was "white men only". The average white zoomer does not have an IQ of 100, you people couldn't do single variable algebra at 16 and the racial distribution of SAT scores proved that, before your country stopped using them out of embarrassment.
Have a good one, you will never get your jobs back. Even with 100% remigration, openai/google/anthropic won't hire you and in a decade all white collar work will be automated by ASI, we're actually working very hard towards that end. Then we'll settle our grievances the old fashioned way when everyone is part of the permanent underclass. That's what you're looking forward to with or without immigration.
> just looking for better opportunities and taking them
The fact that you have no theory of mind for people who do not like being parasitized is very telling. Every single civilized people in all of human history recognized that abusing hospitality for personal gain was subhuman behavior.
For all of your self-righteousness and arrogance, you are in the exact same category as the Somalis, Pakistanis, and Haitians that also came here to "take better opportunities". The fact that people, even liberals, hate you a lot more than they hate them can be chalked up to your people being uniquely unaesthetic.
"to show them the argument against Indian migration isn’t motivated by bigotry or racism, but is based on common sense. (...) I love Indian food and will continue to, no matter what, with special love for south Indian coconut curries and many such spice things Malabar. I love Indian music and share the 1960’s Hippies’ admiration for Ravi Shankar and the like…"
Is this the "Bronze Age Pervert" or some washed out hippie writing for Vox?
All rationality and reason is useless at this point regarding the Indians. Unfortunately for them, being fellaheen tropical people's they tend to illicit a disgust response in Northern Europeans and their colonial descendents.
All the post hoc intellectualised analysis is just cover for something that is felt very deep in the bones once exposure reaches a certain point and economic times turn tough. It's also one of the reasons the Japanese and Koreans are far more tolerated, they are similarly temperate people's that easily adapted to western mores.
It's why our women don't care at all about letting fly with racist vitriol towards them, as the disgust response is strongest in them. The women hatred is also far more concerning long term for their safety as they are the far crueler sex.
Note how Protestant people's (Anglo-Germanic) in subtropical climates (South Africa, American South, Northern Australia) have always had far more exclusionist policies towards ethnic mixing than those who stayed in the cooler climates, the latter of whom only had to deal with foreigners in the abstract. Now that the more equatorial people's have gone as far as the temperate homelands those who live there are starting to mirror similar attitudes. Catholics always mixed readily, and this to me hits at the ethnic differences between southern and northern Europeans and the phenotype retention drive of the northerns.
The myth of meritocracy was expunged the moment it was manufactured by Harvard elites, namely James Bryant Conant. The results of that are irreversible. The neo-slavery we are conducting ourselves in now through the importation of workers is a way to not resolve that but adapt to it.
What’s wrong with bigotry when it comes to Indians? From their unsanitary, backwards culture to the way they termite-like dig in to whatever company that gets an Indian middle manager.*
There’s nothing wrong with bigotry against Indians. It’s self defense.
*Take ANY company that hires an Indian middle manager, and visit it a year later. Somehow, as if by magic, it has gone from a majority white workplace to AT LEAST 50% Indian. And always from his particular subgroup/clan of Jeets.
This phenomenon is almost surely due to commands from the top. CEO or VP decides: let's lower the cost structure by hiring Indians. They hire a company like Cognizant or simply some Indian middle manager with the directive: replace everyone with an Indian. It's not driven by the middle manager.
Here's a secret: Indians don't like each other. Hence the low trust society. They don't want each other to succeed. They don't want to help each other. When you note a phenomenon like what you observe, there's a much more likely explanation than "they only hire their own."
Great article friend, and in return I will say that I have great appreciation for your book and show. Though I have had to seperate myself from almost all RW sectors now due to the absolute hostility, I will always treasure your work, along with that of some others like Agent, Moldbug, and Land.
I have chosen not to emigrate, despite various opportunities, because I wish to stay and build here. There’s amazing potential, both human and economic, simply lying there because most educated Indians are pushed to get out and pursue a career or higher education in a place where they aren’t discriminated against. (We have had our own equivalent of what white americans are experiencing now, except with lower castes and tribes being given privileges and quotas over the rest instead of races)
Now that the Chinese are allied with us and less retarded communists are getting put into power, great changes are already happening, like the recent developments in industry under Stalin in Tamil Nadu, and there will be far less negative incentive for emigration. I wish you all the best, and I hope America will get more leaders like Trump who stifle immigration and provide opportunities for the natives.
Can you speak more of this Chinese alliance? From everything Ive read on twitter and media, there seems to be not only historical animosity but structural, unresolvable tensions stemming from two great countries sharing a land border. Although there is subsection of indian twitter that I follow which advocates for less kanging to “learn from the chinese example”. Anyways, very curious abt ur take on the situation and how the domestic (non-internet?) sentiment is on chinese cooperation
I’m gonna miss the populist right wing , as a young Indian Gen Z guy .
I imagine this is what It feels like to get kicked out of a tribe . I’ll miss the gang , Tucker , BAP, Fuentes , and all the anons . I am now the enemy 🤣. Good bye my old internet world, now my feed will just be normies
Honestly, you could move to India. The hate is tied to an apparent entitlement to live in our homelands. Before that entitlement became apparent, American righties saw BJP as a fun curiosity.
But when a group fails to police its own, elementary game theory means that all of its members must become persona non grata.
I’ll see how the story develops. If the white nationalists do take power and start pushing out Indians , I’ll leave . As long as I have a nice life here , I’ll stay . Not complicated
That sort of arrogance is why the world hates you. I’m sure China and Pakistan will enjoy the world you’ve created for yourselves, where Americans and Europeans would sooner frag their officers than rush to India’s defense when its neighbors decide they’d like more land.
How is it arrogant? Everyone hates everyone and competes for power constantly. When the whites ruled the world they then had 2 world wars.
From the excellent western author will durant “the first biological lesson of history is that life is competition. Competition is not only the life of trade, it is the trade of life — peaceful when food abounds, violent when the mouths outrun the food. Animals eat one another without qualm; civilized men consume one another by due process of law.”
This is nothing new. We survived to this point and are doing really well. 1/5 of the world is Indian and our elite are everywhere.
As far as I can tell, you white nationalists have been crying about Israel for 30 years now and still give them all the tax money and weapons. Peasants hate. They hated the British elite , the Indian elite , the Russian elite etc etc. but how often is a communist/facist revolution successful ? And those systems still create elites and peasants
The Left is structured such that everyone in the hierarchy sees those above them as peers. You are not the Jews' equals. They are very clear on that. You fall into the same category as the Somalis and Haitians being imported. Expendable parasites being brought in to make life worse for the natives in hope that complicating their lives will slow their expulsion from power.
Keep it simple stupid . My life is awesome here. If that changes I’ll leave . How my demographic is seen in the abstract by Jews , Catholics , wasps , Mexicans , blacks etc etc . doesn’t change that basic calculus
The only way to join the tribe is to fight and sacrifice on behalf of it. It's how millions of Irish, Germans, and Italians became accepted into the American fold: by fighting in WWII. This is the only way different factions can unite into a single nation.
Look at how Stephen Miller is fighting for Americans. He both creates goodwill among heritage Americans for Jews and sets and example for other Jews to follow. (Unfortunately, there are very few others like him.)
Fundamentally I am an economic migrant. I don’t see myself as a white Christian, am not one, and am not looking to assimilate into that identity.
I see myself as strongly influenced by American culture (freedom of speech, following laws paying taxes treating others with respect and dignity) but I’m here for economic opportunity which I have achieved like many other Indian migrants and am grateful for.
At one point I sided with the “alt-right” since I felt my deeply held traditional values were getting systematically challenged, but now they are a threat to my peace and prosperity and we are no longer allies. That’s the nature of politics. My goal was never to be a white Christian, rather , an Indian American. A Indian working in good faith in the American empire.
You don't need to be a white Christian to be an American. Unlike India who's fundamental identity is Hinduism (and despite what many here might say) America's fundamental value isn't Christianity, it's liberty. One might argue that liberty cannot exist without Christianity, which may or may not be true, I don't know. But the Declaration and the Constitution were not put in place to enshrine Christianity. Over my lifetime, Christianity has dwindled in importance in America, and I'm not sure it's going to make a comeback, though I hope it does: I'd rather live as a Hindu in a more Christian America than woke America.
If you came here only for economic reasons, it's probably not a good place for you. You don't intend to join the nation. There might be better places for you like Singapore or Dubai.
That’s just an opinion. Many millions view America as a powerful economic zone. And the economic magnet is stronger than the cultural magnet for many. America respects and loves capital at the end of the day. This is a very capitalist country , more so than its democratic values. That’s why special interests tend to win. There are many who see this as a bad thing and that America should go back to being an explicitly white Christian country where only white men who owned land could vote, but today it’s really a capitalist country
But economic values alone cannot sustain a nation. Most Indians in America unfortunately view America the same way you do, and that will create rifts eventually. Someone whose father fought in Vietnam, grandfather fought in WWII, etc cannot be lumped with a purely economic minded migrant under the same umbrella of "nation". We're seeing the consequences of that playing out right now.
Also, not to sidetrack the discussion too much, but the reason why only white men landowners could vote back in the day is because they had the most skin-in-the-game for the future of the nation. It's the same reason people with children are more conservative that those without, why investors in hedge funds usually require the manager to have his own money in the fund, and why people accused of serious crimes have to put down money to be free until trial: there is significant downside to bad decision making.
Similarly, it would be prudent if Muslims could not vote in India, because despite some individual free thinkers, as a collective, their loyalty is to the Ummah, not to India.
I don’t disagree. However, the British empire and now the American empire created a globalized world of economic interests and that is the world we live in today.
America today is a multi ethnic empire driven on economy. What is American culture today ? Hip hop? Christianity ? Trump? Can you even define its values? Are there shared values? It’s an empire not a nation state. Rome was a patchwork of economic interests with military might as well.
Can you make America a homogenous culture at this point that prioritizes certain values? It would be a very different America. Would I stay ? The rich have freedom to choose where to reside. I stay in America in its present iteration
And just fyi, there are Indian communities all over the world. If USA goes bad for Indian community there is the rest of the western world , south east Asia , china , Russia , all kinds of places for us to go
This is well done and balanced. As was Enoch's speech, a man who loved India. I will spell it out for you . This is BAPs 'rivers of blood' speech on the future for Indians and Americans if the Indians and American establishment continue with current immigration and employment practices:
'As I look ahead, I am filled with foreboding; like the Roman,
I seem to see "the River Tiber foaming with much blood."
Indians managed to retain a broadly sympathetic sentiment in the UK until very recently, with Dvija Hindu doctors and rustic Punjabi factory workers being seen as basically law-abiding, industrious and willing to integrate, if liable to overly aromatic cooking.
The recent proliferation of Boriswave Deliveroo Shudras in the UK has tarnished all our names. That, and the crimes of our increasingly restive Pakistani Muslim cousins whom the average White Brit struggles to conceptually distinguish us from.
Does the term foot in the door mean anything to you. Or does your pet like admiration of the first round of migration via poetics mean more?
There are ethnic differences between the old & new migrants tbh.
Indus Valley (Punjab) v Gangetic.
So you imported your petty caste divisions? I did business in India for a decade. So your telling me you imported all that petty shit where each caste LARP who is more white?
I sold white skin cream btw. Marketed as a value added good from Switzerland. We had a dutch teenage blue eyed girl on the label. Maybe you have seen it.
We're on the border with Pakistan and cluster with Afghanistan more than mainland India. Are you going to tell the North East who look like Chinks the same thing?
Caste is wrong simply because it lets niggers live.
There is plenty of space in that era. I did business in India for a decade. I am aware of the nuance.
I can appreciate it to
There is tons of space in central asia. Beautiful new city states could be birthed. A network state of your peoples capital. You offshore Yuan capital flight. The Swiss of central asia. What ever it takes
You guys don’t get it. Everyone is just making a claim on your space. The entire “vitality” movement is a limited hangout. There is no vitality without space. Without adequate space you are just a sickly organism. Lebensraum.Corn spaced too close? Cabbage? Up to 10× less yield. Animals in close cages? 10× chance of disease.Making concessions to any round of immigrants so they can have your space? Lol.Pause for a moment you retards. Especially BAP. He is 45 and his hobby is fucking mulatto gay for pay in a favela. He is not a tiger who needs space. He is a by-product of high entropy environments that lack space. Migrants with poor dads in a striver suburb.Mao? Stalin? They provided new space for a new generation.Why is it anyone’s job to give concessions to Indians. New or old. If they want more space. They can do the dirty, and elect a lizard to devour the population.But they are a cucked pacifist Hindu society where eating meat is seen as an eternal sin.So for their cuckery you must give concessions??
Yeah I agree. Not sure if you were replying to me.
No, as someone living in England and privy to private discussions among native Whites, they never viewed having Indians as desirable. Southall & Wembley & Leicester have always been regarded with derision.
It’s not a hard problem, it is just a matter of will, unlike say deporting 10 million illegals which seems like fantasy to me. I say this as someone very familiar with the tech industry (have worked years in so called Big Tech) and the Indian situation. Most Indians, especially the competent tech workers that are on H1b getting 200k+ salaries are on an H1b that gets renewed every year while they’re waiting for their green cards (which has a multiple decades long wait line). Just don’t renew their H1bs and they’ll leave, they’re not going to become illegal fast food workers just to stay in US, they have a reasonably pleasant life waiting for them back in India (sucks if they’re a fan of skiing though).
But there’s also a large number of illegal Indians in US now, and a lot of supposedly legal Indians who are just gaming the system through consultancies and other scams. The 100k requirement for every H1b application (even one time is fine) would kill most of this. Honestly I think 100k per year that we thought Trump was implementing was ideal, it would kill most early career immigration and keep the good folks that I don’t have a problem with. On that note, even the O1 has got to go, a highly paid H1b is far better technically than the average O1, there are all sorts of scams going on in the O1 system with buying conference papers, reference letters, judging worthless competitions etc etc.
In the end, this is a question of will, there are very simple solutions, we don’t even need an operation wetback 2.0, a few simple rules and we can get rid of 90% of such immigration.
Yes BAP great article. Most 2nd gen indians will completely agree with you, even liberal ones, especially ones in UK and Canada. Besides just feelings of embarrassment toward our unassimilated co-ethnics, we are also more acutely aware of the deeper consequences of mass immigration, many of which you have accurately surfaced in this article. Wat can be done, this poses civilizational
I'm sorry, but there is absolutely no way that "most" 2nd generation Indians would agree that the current state of Indian immigration is problematic. That is total fantasy.
Privately, yes. Just not in front of Canadians.
As with all things. We are all Canadian, but only to a point
Many do I've spoken with several. Parents put them into the full Canadian experience, played hockey as a kid, went to university, doing corporate jobs, some medicine. They agree. One upset because their parents are being treated differently now.
We don't want assimilated ones either.
Electoral coalition doesn't exist for kicking out the good browns, big man.
For better or worse, the average Brit isn't going to countenance deporting Rishi Sunak. Discussions toward this end are LARP and masturbation.
I genuinely don’t think takes of this nature matter, and they are generally couched in lame attempts to deride and shame. No. We want nations, not pretend playthings for faggot merchants.
I don't really see democracy as being viable in the yookay. Whatever happens there will be at the sole discretion of the first guy to prevent the government from stopping him from solving the migrant problem however he prefers to do so.
No one thinks Rishi Sunak is British, and his ilk will leave Britain when the climate shifts to a more outwardly ethnonationalist legislation.
The natives want the second-gen Indians to go, too.
I find myself wishing I were more sympathetic. Like you and your examples, I harbored some admiration for elements of Indian culture. Especially its history of religion, as I would discuss regularly with a Hindu (a convert, but very theologically minded) friend of mine. Surely there must be something that fascinated the world in general, and the minds of Anglo luminaries in particular, about a land they tried so long and so desperately to have as their own.
And yet I find myself now simply out of patience. Whatever the wonders of the Subcontinent, its history, culture, religion, etc., the constant, day in and day out, actions and behaviors of its people are so far removed from those formidable heights it seems the only rational conclusion is that there's simply no connection between the achievements of the past and the people today. Even as Indians themselves thump their chests over it, it all comes off a bit like Boomer conservative reference for the Founders or Constitution: endlessly counting one's (alleged) ancestors more dearly than one's sons.
You make a heartful appeal to those genuinely capable, talented Indians. Those that must surely have endured much to escape what are genuinely among the most wretched conditions still on Earth. And yet, over and over, we're subject to these "elite" emigres siding time and against with the very worst aspects of their society. Dinesh D'souza, someone who's been in the US for forty years and has probably few familial ties to his country of origin, recently boasting that the future belongs to poo-throwers, comes to mind. Like he's gleeful even now to hurl people he himself would have nothing to do with as missiles at non-Indians. To harbor such gloating resentment for so long would almost be impressive in its determination, if it weren't so tirelessly predictable.
I suppose in the end, it just feels like it's all been one massive fraud. A Potemkin culture propped up by 19th century Anglo fascination in the other that has long since faded to reality. One that was evident as early as the ballads of Kipling (himself quite enamored with India and having lived there nearly all his life) making sharp critiques of the locals' shameless striver mentality. Even though I agree much of the critique has lost substance and devolved into zero-effort copycat posting for clout, the fatigue is real, and I suspect we're all going to be waiting a long time before their "highly skilled, elite human capital," develops any qualms over their frankly cartoonish cruelty.
BAP addressed this in the article, if you saw. He said it’s a classical/antique “flavor” of the highest heights existing alongside the lowest lows (in human quality terms).
From my personal experience, knowing Indians/other desis from across the gamut of castes and regions, I think he’s definitely right. I’ve known (desi) artists & musicians, electrical engineers, inventors, all of whom were genuinely good (and I say that as a highly disagreeable heritage American who is not so easily impressed), and I’ve known convenience store owners and Mirpuri (yes we have them too) criminal retards that made me wonder why exactly I pay taxes if this is what the government does to my city.
The salient point now is that the numbers are unassimilable, irreconcilable, even if we were *trying* to assimilate them (which as BAP points out we don’t). But that fact doesn’t remove the obvious reality that many subcons of genuine quality are here, and there is much to like about India and (good) Indians, while still acknowledging that we shouldn’t let any more move here, should probably deport most of those already here, and should certainly disenfranchise that whole population in terms of political and judicial power.
You people don't help your case when you use words like “frankly cartoonish cruelty" and “harbor such gloating resentment for so long", especially if you're an anglo. What do you think was a reasonable middle ground after the anglos having leeched off everything they could from India. I won't say “45 trillion" but the anglos did come to India only to extract wealth and that was their whole incentive for two centuries. They left the country poorer than subsaharan Africa and now you're mad that the descendants of those people have enough agency to thrive in your home at your expense, in the least violent way possible?
The fatigue you have is real and if I was in your shoes I'd think so too but the white fatigue is much older and more intolerable at this point with the most vocal complaints about tech workers being replaced coming from people whose entire lives revolve around America's God, politics. Most Indians don't come to America with an idea of exacting revenge but simply because there's better opportunities, but the discourse has demonized Indians to the point that this framework is how the ruling cabinet now operates with. Don't be surprised when the other side recognizes it and acts accordingly.
Every civilization has its ups and downs and the conquerors don't just get to walk away and not integrate with the conquered. Ask the Romans who enslaved the Greeks if it worked out for them, when their slaves were far wiser and more productive than the masters they were forced to serve.
"Most Indians don't come to America with an idea of exacting revenge but simply because there's better opportunities, but the discourse has demonized Indians to the point that this framework is how the ruling cabinet now operates with."
What do you think was the genesis of this demonization? Where did it spring from? What is the motivation?
Simple ethnic resentment won't do it for you? 20th century was unprecedented in human history so a bunch of problems were offset by it. Now, opportunities are drying up and more people are competing for a shrinking pool of opportunities. They see immigrants come in and succeed which is worse than importing an underclass from central america, per the modal citizen thing BAP talked about.
Nothing about Indians' low trust behavior? Building 100 foot statues on deities on the landscape? Voting against the interests of heritage Americans 80% of time?
In fact, no. Whites have the same seething ethno narcissism they project onto others. Do you vote for Indian interests? Why should anyone vote against their interests? Say more Indian Americans has voted for Trump and historically voted Republican, would whites stop resenting them for being browns and succeeding in America? They're a small enough population that it wouldn't have prevented Obama or similar, and any Indian Americans who voted for Trump still log onto twitter and see frothing resentment even for benign things like posting photos of their festivals. Why would any rational man vote for that?
What are you even arguing about with 100 foot statues? Did the state subsidize them with your tax dollars?
No, I don't vote for Indian interests. I vote for American interests. Nation first.
Having been in America for 40+ years and found success, I know for a fact that whites have never resented me for success. They appreciated Indian (and immigrant) success. The recent backlash against Indians is very new (last 5 years) and is based on a few things:
1) The overwhelming amount of influx of Indians over the last decade. Entire departments of corporations being fired and turned over to low wage commodity white collar labor H1-Bs under the false pretense of "we couldn't find any American to fill these roles."
2) Low trust behaviors--cutting in line, trying to negotiate set prices, reneging handshake deals, etc. About ten years ago, I noticed that contractors in my city (mostly Mexican) refused to work with Indians for these reasons.
3) Woke views and doing the bidding of the woke industrial complex against the interests of heritage Americans with some very public figures at the forefront-- Vijaya Gadde, Parag Agarwal, Sundar Pichai, Pramila Jayapal, Saira Rao, etc.
"They resent us because we are outcompeting them." Indentured servitude is not outcompeting. It's making yourself a temporary slave.
The idea that Indians are now outcompeting is laughable. You don't outcompete if your message is...
"Dear American corporation--
I'll work for longer hours and fewer dollars than the American and I won't even have a choice to leave or I'll have to go back to India."
...you are not outcompeting. You are selling your labor for less.
Outcompeting would entail charging more for your labor as you would be more valuable than the next guy.
What I see in your post is insecurity (very common among Indians) mollifying itself as "we're finally winning and the whites are jealous." You're not winning. You're prostituting yourself at low prices on behalf of billionaires who are happy to throw their fellow Americans into the river for higher profits.
I'm arguing about 100 foot statues because that behavior is a violation of American cultural norms. It doesn't help your cause.
Your worldview is fundamentally incompatible with American civilization. You should move to a country that is more in line with your worldview.
As one of these Indians in America (though came much much earlier than the recent surge) who loves America and American culture (at least the culture that existed in the 80s and 90s but unfortunately does not today), I largely agree with the article with some small counters below. First some comments towards Indians if you're reading this:
1) Indians need to recognize they are cheap labor. Yes, that's right, you are cheap labor. In the current surge, you are white collar Mexicans. Your immigration surge has been sold to the public as "skilled labor" but make no mistake, you are cheap commodity labor being used to replace white Americans who cost more to employ than you.
Why would whites do this? Just as there are Hindus in India that work against the thriving of Hinduism in India and want nothing more than the destruction of Hindu civilization, there are whites in America who want nothing more than to see whites suffer.
2) You did not invent Silicon Valley. American innovation existed long before there was a single Indian in America and would continue if every single Indian was deported.
3) You know how Muslims will block the road and start praying in groups? You know the motivation there: it's a flex and a dare: "What are you going to do about it?" A softer version of that is building giant statues of Hindu deities on the American landscape that can be seen by the public from afar. There are no giant statues of Jesus or Mary on the landscape nor even giant crosses. Be polite toward the host culture and stop that shit right now.
4) Have some appreciation for why America "works" and India doesn't. America will stop working if too many Indians come all at once.
5) Stop blaming Americans for historic British actions. America was also part of the colonial project. They fought (and defeated) in war the British.
6) Why come to America if you're only going to congregate among other Indians? Do you just want India with better infrastructure?
7) Just because Indians came to America in the past does not mean that every Indian has a right to come to America forever. There's a time and place for immigration and these circumstances change over time. America is currently heading toward a huge slowdown, and perhaps even a complete stop in immigration.
Notes to BAP and Indian skeptics:
1) While I appreciate the ideas of the Vedas, there's a slightly different aspect by which I appreciate Hinduism: that of divinity in all things, whether nature, the self, the Universe, or other people. We offer prayers to the Sun upon rising, revere the nature around us, hold sacred the cow which feeds us and our children, bless the food which nourishes us before each meal by first offering to the gods, revere the knowledge which enlightens us (never to touch a book with our feet), bow down before our parents that raise us, and try to become one with the Universe which created us. There's divinity in all things to greater or lesser degrees. These ideas are better distilled in the Upanishads which I think you've praised before.
(To others, you might only know about Hinduism through monkey gods and elephant gods, but Hinduism is a rich philosophical tradition whose essential idea--"dharma"--is basically way to seek ways to build civilization.)
2) I think your characterization of Patels and of other Indians' views of Patels is off. Patels are a hard working, simple living, fairly uncorrupt (IMO) group. In America they are much more likely to vote conservative, and Gujarat is the most pro Hindu state in India, least tolerant of Islamic shenanigans, and the most highly developed as well. They are traditionally NOT a mercantile caste, but rather a farmer or "kulak" status. Most Indians respect Gujaratis. See these threads on Quora (a great place to mine for sentiment about all things India).
https://www.quora.com/What-do-other-Indians-think-of-Gujaratis-What-instantly-comes-to-your-mind-when-youre-told-someones-a-Gujarati
IMO, the sentiment among Indians toward Gujaratis is similar to what Americans think of Mormons, or did so about 10-20 years ago.
Note that most of the elite Indian-Americans who work against Americans (Vijaya Gadde, Sundar Pichai, Saira Rao, the Silicon Valley elite, etc) are not Patels or Gujaratis. The typical South Indian elite tech worker in San Francisco is much more likely to look down upon everyday Americans, embrace wokism, and vote Democrat.
3) I appreciate your views of what India would be like without Hinduism. IMO, it would turn into Pakistan or Afghanistan. Not a mode for thriving. India can only thrive with Hinduism, which is why it's risen to prominence under the first Hindu-first leader in the better part of a thousand years (Modi).
4) Also appreciate your thoughts on what Europe and America might be like under a polytheistic order. While in my lifetime, Christianity falling has resulted in a worsening of the culture, and I wish Christianity would make a comeback as a bulwark against wokism, the European people have thrived before under polytheism (Greek history and most of Roman history) and might thrive again.
I should add that despite my chosen handle, neither I nor my family are in the Motel business. That's was a tongue-in-cheek choice of name.
"there are whites in America who want nothing more than to see whites suffer." ... yes but all of these are either women or Jews.
What you say is largely true, but there are a lot of gentile white males in the Northeast, along the West Coast, in academia, media, marketing, and board rooms who absolutely hate white America.
See the Nick Land tweet. “Never get so racist that you forget white leftists are the worst people in existence”. Obviously there exist white (male) leftists—unless you think all European males in the US were pathetically conquered by women and jews, somehow? FDR and LBJ and their many supporters I suppose being women, or jewish?
Every old white man at the no kings protest being jewish too, in your imagination? Every MSNBC-watching zombie retard, too?
There are always a few exceptions to prove the rule.
It’s not a few, it’s like 30+% of white male voters who vote Democrat. Not even close to 30% of white men are jewish
41% of white male voters supported Kamala Harris in the 2024 U.S. presidential election. AP VoteCast data. That’s a lot of white non Jewish men
To be honest, I think the fact that the sheer degree of diplomatic language in this post is necessary will make it insufficient. Any people with the capacity for self-awareness would have been convinced by the self-evident truth that they are making peoples that could conquer them with a thousand riflemen hate them with all of their hearts. Being allowed to behave the way that they have been behaving has pushed their already very limited capacity for introspection past the event horizon.
I don't think there's any diplomatic resolution, here. It ends when a vengeful tide of White male 20-somethings seizes power, cuts off the remittances, and sends the ones who didn't lash out on social media back to India unharmed, sans their belongings. Trying to negotiate something neater is like trying to convince Ben Shapiro not to dig himself any deeper, and Benji's got 30 IQ points on this lot.
What happened to the Italians with the RICO act will come down on Indians in America as well, though probably much more subdued because they’re more spread out across the country, as opposed to one region like the Italians
I'm skeptical of the comparison. Italians did not go out of their way to make the people around them miserable, and were ultimately capable of success and assimilation on a level playing field. You could neatly amputate organized crime from their social structure and still be left with something meaningful after it was gone.
The current wave of Indian migrants was brought in solely to make life worse for the native population. They don't have the option of happily assimilating into America, they are backed solely by a ruling class that wants obedient intermediaries, and their options after that ruling class falls are nonexistent.
No, the options they have after the ruling class fails are violence, which is what you people are edging towards. It would be very funny if WW3 happened because white zoomers had black tier ethnonarcissim and blamed the world for their failures. What's happening now is what happens every time two civilizations clash and one comes out on top: the conquered people won't just sit down for centuries and not try to extract wealth the same way the conquerors did. You people are quick to point out that companies don't hire you because hiring Indians is good for them in the short term at the expense of long term quality, but don't have the foresight to see the anglos of the last 3 centuries in the same light. They left the world's richest nation poorer than subsaharan Africa for their short term gains and you think their descendants would've just taken that face down and not even try their hand in the new world? Who asked England to find colonialism as the easiest way to prosperity?
Your problem is that you're ethnonarcissists and comparatively unagentic to boot. Everything needs to be someone else's fault that you're not winning. If someone who didn't even grow up with your language is succeeding in your home more than you, maybe someday have some humility to think how much of it is your fault than to just see them as malicious actors.
The most insulting thing to me in all this discourse isn't the brimestone tier name calling and insulting our gods, because that's just low IQ seething, but the way many anons on twitter gloat about colonialism while being offensively stupidly blindsided about the repercussions of it. You're living them, and you could've never escaped them in any alternate timeline. I mean it with no malice to you.
> you think their descendants would've just taken that face down
You paint yourselves as righteous rebels wanting revenge. I'm not going to humor that self-important schlock. You came here on a leash, you know full well who let you in, and you serve them even more slavishly than you served the British. Ask the British how they treat useful tools. The Brits at least had IQs of 100 and decent hygiene - Israelis can tolerate a day with a Brit, but they feel the same disgust at an Indian as everyone else on the planet.
You want a historical metaphor? You are ZOG's Tutsis, if the Hutus stood nine inches taller, if the Hutus had twenty more IQ points on average, and if the Tutsis had the arrogance to spend every moment as privileged intermediaries making the Hutus hate them more.
The more I see people like you resent someone just looking for better opportunities and taking them the more I realize you people really would prefer an all out war. It's so tiresome talking to whites, always yapping about IQ and the noise comes from terminally politically active people who wouldn't get a job at Google if the hiring policy was "white men only". The average white zoomer does not have an IQ of 100, you people couldn't do single variable algebra at 16 and the racial distribution of SAT scores proved that, before your country stopped using them out of embarrassment.
Have a good one, you will never get your jobs back. Even with 100% remigration, openai/google/anthropic won't hire you and in a decade all white collar work will be automated by ASI, we're actually working very hard towards that end. Then we'll settle our grievances the old fashioned way when everyone is part of the permanent underclass. That's what you're looking forward to with or without immigration.
> just looking for better opportunities and taking them
The fact that you have no theory of mind for people who do not like being parasitized is very telling. Every single civilized people in all of human history recognized that abusing hospitality for personal gain was subhuman behavior.
For all of your self-righteousness and arrogance, you are in the exact same category as the Somalis, Pakistanis, and Haitians that also came here to "take better opportunities". The fact that people, even liberals, hate you a lot more than they hate them can be chalked up to your people being uniquely unaesthetic.
"to show them the argument against Indian migration isn’t motivated by bigotry or racism, but is based on common sense. (...) I love Indian food and will continue to, no matter what, with special love for south Indian coconut curries and many such spice things Malabar. I love Indian music and share the 1960’s Hippies’ admiration for Ravi Shankar and the like…"
Is this the "Bronze Age Pervert" or some washed out hippie writing for Vox?
LOL 🤣
"Some of my best friends are indian." - by Vox Age Pervert, probably.
All rationality and reason is useless at this point regarding the Indians. Unfortunately for them, being fellaheen tropical people's they tend to illicit a disgust response in Northern Europeans and their colonial descendents.
All the post hoc intellectualised analysis is just cover for something that is felt very deep in the bones once exposure reaches a certain point and economic times turn tough. It's also one of the reasons the Japanese and Koreans are far more tolerated, they are similarly temperate people's that easily adapted to western mores.
It's why our women don't care at all about letting fly with racist vitriol towards them, as the disgust response is strongest in them. The women hatred is also far more concerning long term for their safety as they are the far crueler sex.
Note how Protestant people's (Anglo-Germanic) in subtropical climates (South Africa, American South, Northern Australia) have always had far more exclusionist policies towards ethnic mixing than those who stayed in the cooler climates, the latter of whom only had to deal with foreigners in the abstract. Now that the more equatorial people's have gone as far as the temperate homelands those who live there are starting to mirror similar attitudes. Catholics always mixed readily, and this to me hits at the ethnic differences between southern and northern Europeans and the phenotype retention drive of the northerns.
The myth of meritocracy was expunged the moment it was manufactured by Harvard elites, namely James Bryant Conant. The results of that are irreversible. The neo-slavery we are conducting ourselves in now through the importation of workers is a way to not resolve that but adapt to it.
Us Jews destroyed meritocracy in America. Why waste chutzpah on such a pointless lie? Stop slinging WASPs, our only allies, into the mud.
What’s wrong with bigotry when it comes to Indians? From their unsanitary, backwards culture to the way they termite-like dig in to whatever company that gets an Indian middle manager.*
There’s nothing wrong with bigotry against Indians. It’s self defense.
*Take ANY company that hires an Indian middle manager, and visit it a year later. Somehow, as if by magic, it has gone from a majority white workplace to AT LEAST 50% Indian. And always from his particular subgroup/clan of Jeets.
This phenomenon is almost surely due to commands from the top. CEO or VP decides: let's lower the cost structure by hiring Indians. They hire a company like Cognizant or simply some Indian middle manager with the directive: replace everyone with an Indian. It's not driven by the middle manager.
Here's a secret: Indians don't like each other. Hence the low trust society. They don't want each other to succeed. They don't want to help each other. When you note a phenomenon like what you observe, there's a much more likely explanation than "they only hire their own."
Great article friend, and in return I will say that I have great appreciation for your book and show. Though I have had to seperate myself from almost all RW sectors now due to the absolute hostility, I will always treasure your work, along with that of some others like Agent, Moldbug, and Land.
I have chosen not to emigrate, despite various opportunities, because I wish to stay and build here. There’s amazing potential, both human and economic, simply lying there because most educated Indians are pushed to get out and pursue a career or higher education in a place where they aren’t discriminated against. (We have had our own equivalent of what white americans are experiencing now, except with lower castes and tribes being given privileges and quotas over the rest instead of races)
Now that the Chinese are allied with us and less retarded communists are getting put into power, great changes are already happening, like the recent developments in industry under Stalin in Tamil Nadu, and there will be far less negative incentive for emigration. I wish you all the best, and I hope America will get more leaders like Trump who stifle immigration and provide opportunities for the natives.
Can you speak more of this Chinese alliance? From everything Ive read on twitter and media, there seems to be not only historical animosity but structural, unresolvable tensions stemming from two great countries sharing a land border. Although there is subsection of indian twitter that I follow which advocates for less kanging to “learn from the chinese example”. Anyways, very curious abt ur take on the situation and how the domestic (non-internet?) sentiment is on chinese cooperation
I find nothing substantial in this essay to disagree with. Well done.
– A 2nd-Generation TamBrahm American Citizen
(who also shares your deep affinity for sculpted, well-oiled chest muscles)
I’m gonna miss the populist right wing , as a young Indian Gen Z guy .
I imagine this is what It feels like to get kicked out of a tribe . I’ll miss the gang , Tucker , BAP, Fuentes , and all the anons . I am now the enemy 🤣. Good bye my old internet world, now my feed will just be normies
Honestly, you could move to India. The hate is tied to an apparent entitlement to live in our homelands. Before that entitlement became apparent, American righties saw BJP as a fun curiosity.
But when a group fails to police its own, elementary game theory means that all of its members must become persona non grata.
I’ll see how the story develops. If the white nationalists do take power and start pushing out Indians , I’ll leave . As long as I have a nice life here , I’ll stay . Not complicated
That sort of arrogance is why the world hates you. I’m sure China and Pakistan will enjoy the world you’ve created for yourselves, where Americans and Europeans would sooner frag their officers than rush to India’s defense when its neighbors decide they’d like more land.
How is it arrogant? Everyone hates everyone and competes for power constantly. When the whites ruled the world they then had 2 world wars.
From the excellent western author will durant “the first biological lesson of history is that life is competition. Competition is not only the life of trade, it is the trade of life — peaceful when food abounds, violent when the mouths outrun the food. Animals eat one another without qualm; civilized men consume one another by due process of law.”
This is nothing new. We survived to this point and are doing really well. 1/5 of the world is Indian and our elite are everywhere.
One last point. The reason Indian elites want to establish power globally is well frankly we learned from the British empire.
As far as I can tell, you white nationalists have been crying about Israel for 30 years now and still give them all the tax money and weapons. Peasants hate. They hated the British elite , the Indian elite , the Russian elite etc etc. but how often is a communist/facist revolution successful ? And those systems still create elites and peasants
The Left is structured such that everyone in the hierarchy sees those above them as peers. You are not the Jews' equals. They are very clear on that. You fall into the same category as the Somalis and Haitians being imported. Expendable parasites being brought in to make life worse for the natives in hope that complicating their lives will slow their expulsion from power.
Keep it simple stupid . My life is awesome here. If that changes I’ll leave . How my demographic is seen in the abstract by Jews , Catholics , wasps , Mexicans , blacks etc etc . doesn’t change that basic calculus
The only way to join the tribe is to fight and sacrifice on behalf of it. It's how millions of Irish, Germans, and Italians became accepted into the American fold: by fighting in WWII. This is the only way different factions can unite into a single nation.
Look at how Stephen Miller is fighting for Americans. He both creates goodwill among heritage Americans for Jews and sets and example for other Jews to follow. (Unfortunately, there are very few others like him.)
Fundamentally I am an economic migrant. I don’t see myself as a white Christian, am not one, and am not looking to assimilate into that identity.
I see myself as strongly influenced by American culture (freedom of speech, following laws paying taxes treating others with respect and dignity) but I’m here for economic opportunity which I have achieved like many other Indian migrants and am grateful for.
At one point I sided with the “alt-right” since I felt my deeply held traditional values were getting systematically challenged, but now they are a threat to my peace and prosperity and we are no longer allies. That’s the nature of politics. My goal was never to be a white Christian, rather , an Indian American. A Indian working in good faith in the American empire.
You don't need to be a white Christian to be an American. Unlike India who's fundamental identity is Hinduism (and despite what many here might say) America's fundamental value isn't Christianity, it's liberty. One might argue that liberty cannot exist without Christianity, which may or may not be true, I don't know. But the Declaration and the Constitution were not put in place to enshrine Christianity. Over my lifetime, Christianity has dwindled in importance in America, and I'm not sure it's going to make a comeback, though I hope it does: I'd rather live as a Hindu in a more Christian America than woke America.
If you came here only for economic reasons, it's probably not a good place for you. You don't intend to join the nation. There might be better places for you like Singapore or Dubai.
That’s just an opinion. Many millions view America as a powerful economic zone. And the economic magnet is stronger than the cultural magnet for many. America respects and loves capital at the end of the day. This is a very capitalist country , more so than its democratic values. That’s why special interests tend to win. There are many who see this as a bad thing and that America should go back to being an explicitly white Christian country where only white men who owned land could vote, but today it’s really a capitalist country
But economic values alone cannot sustain a nation. Most Indians in America unfortunately view America the same way you do, and that will create rifts eventually. Someone whose father fought in Vietnam, grandfather fought in WWII, etc cannot be lumped with a purely economic minded migrant under the same umbrella of "nation". We're seeing the consequences of that playing out right now.
Also, not to sidetrack the discussion too much, but the reason why only white men landowners could vote back in the day is because they had the most skin-in-the-game for the future of the nation. It's the same reason people with children are more conservative that those without, why investors in hedge funds usually require the manager to have his own money in the fund, and why people accused of serious crimes have to put down money to be free until trial: there is significant downside to bad decision making.
Similarly, it would be prudent if Muslims could not vote in India, because despite some individual free thinkers, as a collective, their loyalty is to the Ummah, not to India.
I don’t disagree. However, the British empire and now the American empire created a globalized world of economic interests and that is the world we live in today.
America today is a multi ethnic empire driven on economy. What is American culture today ? Hip hop? Christianity ? Trump? Can you even define its values? Are there shared values? It’s an empire not a nation state. Rome was a patchwork of economic interests with military might as well.
Can you make America a homogenous culture at this point that prioritizes certain values? It would be a very different America. Would I stay ? The rich have freedom to choose where to reside. I stay in America in its present iteration
And just fyi, there are Indian communities all over the world. If USA goes bad for Indian community there is the rest of the western world , south east Asia , china , Russia , all kinds of places for us to go
Everywhere except India huh
I would go back to India too. I can't live like a Ambani https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kO-MXG7WTVw
but... would be in elite section yes. Avg indian situation very bad materially.
You're really leaning into the centrist thing, huh?
Bap has realized the current right has no future. Liberalism truly is the end of history
This is well done and balanced. As was Enoch's speech, a man who loved India. I will spell it out for you . This is BAPs 'rivers of blood' speech on the future for Indians and Americans if the Indians and American establishment continue with current immigration and employment practices:
'As I look ahead, I am filled with foreboding; like the Roman,
I seem to see "the River Tiber foaming with much blood."